Tuesday, July 13, 2010

Sex Education - Helena Style

At least Montana is making the national news for something ...................  even if it is for our Helena school systems sexual views


  1. First of all I would not describe these clips as "national news" Both clip were from the republican ministry of propaganda, also known as Faux News.

    Also I think ALL Montanans should be offended and outraged when boy wonder Sean Hannity DIRECTLY stated that Montana schools CANNOT "teach kids to read,write and do math" (top clip 2:16) while choosing to teach this subject, while simultanously (and I am guessing wrongly) stressing that homosexuality was being promoted and encouraged in this class.

    To put these two clips on this blog is UNfair, and UNbalanced. It should be more rightly described as WE report so WE decide.

  2. Let’s see; worldwide viewership, one of the most watched networks in America …………….. I would dispute that they were not “national” news

    Many Montana schools are actually failing in the “reading, writing, and math” standards just as Hannity stated.

    What the real problem with this program is that the liberals don’t want anyone to hear these things. Take a look at the comments on the Fox program why don’t you? You will see that many thousands disagree with you which is not a big surprise. Why is it no one ever comes on here to complain about the biased and/or partial fact changing CNN reports? Or why doesn’t anyone complain about the liberal anti-business anti-community Havre Daily News?

    To quote your idiot leader…………..You guys are a kick!

  3. You really have to take what the media says in this country with a grain of salt. There all full of crap half the time. If you have sat. T.V rather than bresnan i would recommend watching networks from other countries. You will notice a heck of a difference. If you watch CNN or Foxnews just listen to the first 2 sentences than change the channel because your about to witness bullshit spewing.

  4. Freddy said: "Why is it no one ever comes on here to complain about the biased and/or partial fact changing CNN reports?"

    Perhaps because CNN has never gone to court to establish their right to lie in their news reports while FOX has. Ya think that might be it?

    Of course, Hannity is NOT a news show. It is an opinion show, period.

  5. DeConstructor: Have you read the academic progress of these schools you defend?

    First I watched the program last night and if you listen, Hannity did not say Montana schools cannot teach kids to read write and do math, he was referring to all schools.

    Indeed Helena Public Schools does not own the keys to the failing eduction system because the entire system can be blamed for that. We have lost our focus as a nation. We no longer teach reading, writing and arithmetic as we once did, now we hold eachothers hands and apologize for our failing teachers and move the kids on through the system like sheep to the slaughter.

    The reason folks are outraged about this issue is because what purpose does it serve other than to promote an agenda? In the other post we got so far off in the weeds talking about why we need sex education. This is not sex eduction. This curriculum is about teaching the youngest of the school children to accept alternative lifestyles. THAT IS NOT THE SCHOOL DISTRICTS BUSINESS! Hannity's point was right on the money, we cannot teach our kids the fundamentals why would we want these teachers planting these ideas in their heads, especially at such a young age!

    Get a grip people, Helena Public Schools math proficiency scores were 61%. Havre Public Schools was 58% at last publishing. How do you expect to compete in a global economy (and Montana's is because we export our kids!) when India and China have math and reading proficiency at 90% or more. This is why our nation will continue to fail academically compared with the other superpowers because of our intense liberalization of our schools with political correctness.

    Focus on the basics, that is what kids need to learn to function in society, this other stuff is unnecessary social engineering.

  6. I think what issue that is failing to be addressed is why Helena is revamping their sex education?

    Could it be that Teen pregnancy rates are ridiculous and a high percentage of teens don't use birth control?

    Many teens don't even understand their bodies or how ovulation or pregnancy even work.

    They don't know costs of raising children or how the consequences of not rising above their hormones and thinking clearly.

    We want to sit here and degrade new shows and other bloggers, but in actuality, we are avoiding the true issues at hand.

    I mean, two comments in and we are already calling the other bloggers names because of their political affiliation.

    "Liberal" parents are not the only ones with teens getting pregnant, so are "conservative" parents.

    This is in actual issue with long term effects. If our teens keep having children, it will keep our tax dollars going int the welfare system and other government aid systems, and taxes will rise to cover these institutions.

    Not to mention the quality of life for children born by teenagers is lesser and the fact that its rarely the teens themselves that shoulder the responsibility, but their parents and the rest of society.

    But I keep forgetting, we live in a perfect, Christian nation, where we can just sweep what we don't like under the rug, and if anyone tries to make changes, they are a blasphemous liberal.

  7. Oh and get off of Fox News, if you don't like it don't watch!

    Shawn do you know why the foreign news is so different? Its because almost all of the news channels around the world are government owned, state run news sources. The U.S. is one of the last places in the world with a "free" press.

    And Surely--don't fall fot the trap. Have any of Fox News' detractors ever convinced a court that lies were in fact broadcasted? If so I'd like to see the facts and the source.

  8. Dandelionflame, (sorry you all are posting so fast I cannot incorporate all my comments in one, I apologize!!)

    I am not saying we should not have true sex education--that is what health class and biology are for. What I object to is the social engineering of accepting alternative lifestyles by teaching it to K-2 which don't even have the ability understand such social concepts.

    Don't get me wrong there are a lot more issues in this curriculum that concern me that have absolutely nothing to do with the biology of sex, but the K-2 curriculum is absurd.

  9. Railroader said: "And Surely--don't fall fot the trap. Have any of Fox News' detractors ever convinced a court that lies were in fact broadcasted? If so I'd like to see the facts and the source."

    Who mentioned "detractors"? Fox news THEMSELVES went to Court and argued, successfully, that they have the right misinform/lie to the public.

    Simply put, FOX sued to establish that they can lie.

    Here is a link although there are thousands of them.


  10. I just see nothing wrong with teaching children tolerance and educating them about their bodies.

    If they actually know how sex works, it won't be such a mystery and abstinence could possibly be argued for even more.

    Also, I do agree that a fifth grader learning sex positions and sex act may be too young...but many kids are having sex by 11 and 12 years old, or at least performing said sexual acts. Education could prevent these acts or diseases and pregnancies caused by the acts.

    I do agree with DeConstructor that the coverage by HDC on this was bias. Planned Parenthood of Montana has been very active in helping in Helena and taking supporters to Helena for this. Organizations like that should be contacted for their coverage as well.

  11. Here is the Helena Independent Records story:


  12. Thanks for the link dandelionflame. I found this comment interesting and am curios what others think:

    “I hope the school board will spend our resources that will help them succeed the most — preparing them for college,” local pediatric dentist Kevin Rencher said.

    I always thought high school was about preparing kids for LIFE. Certainly that may involve college but not for everyone.

    Thoughts fellow readers?

  13. Ok, Surely--you really should stop reading all these nonsensical websites, by the way you can get spyware from some of them like the one you mentioned in your post. I got an Internet Explorer error when I tried to open it and then my Norton Virus Scanner popped up so be careful!

    The facts of the case you mentioned are as follows and since you seem to have some kind of a legal mind I'll assume you can follow this as I am just a dumb railroader who Googled this stuff on my day off!

    First you are referring to the Jane Akre story where she and her husband Steve Wilson filed a lawsuit against a Fox News Affiliate WTVT in Tampa Florida under the whistleblower statutes because she felt her contract termination was in retaliation over a dispute involving distortion of facts in a health issue report on a milk hormone additive. The affiliate did not run Akre's story because of pressure from Monsanto was the allegation. All of Wilson's claims were dismissed by the lower court, the only claim Akre won was that she was protected under the whistleblower staute. It was that finding which was later overturned by the appellate court because it did not meet the statutory requirement of a whistleblower claim nor did Akre even state the claim in writing.

    Those are the facts of the case, the only case and the Big Bad Fox News was only involved as a matter of legally defending its affiliate's decison to terminate the contract of Wilson and Akre and the court found that termination legal and with basis. The notion that Roger Ailes somehow told the affiliate to burn the story because of pressure from Monsanto is just political fodder and the lower court found that issue to be nongermane to the claim.

    The left has distorted this story so many times its like the "I cuaght a fish this big" stories you here at the bars in Fort Peck! It's a liberal's idea of harmony--Monstanto and Fox News--lions, tigers and bears oh my!!!

    Sorry Surely--you're playing in the political fringe end of the pool on this one!

  14. Railroader - Let me find the appellate ruling and I will post it. I have read it and it is as I have suggested.

    The lawyer for Fox argued before the appellate Court that they are under no duty to be honest in their reporting.

    You can try to pooh pooh this as leftist propoganda but the facts, and the appellate record (including the specific claims by FOX), are a matter of record.

    As Casey Stengel used to say: You can look it up.

    NOTE: I should not have stated that Fox "sued" for the right to misinform/lie as it was actually their argument before the appellate court. My apologies.

  15. Quick bit of info while I search for the complete appellate record:

    In it's opinion, the Court of Appeal held that the Federal Communications Commission position against news distortion is only a "policy," not a promulgated law, rule, or regulation.

  16. Here is a link to the Appellate Court ruling. The pertinent part (to our discussion) is in the end of the 1st paragraph of page 4.

    I had at one time found a link to the actual verbatim argument as put forth by the Fox attorney. I will continue to look for that.

  17. Oops - Here is the link (duh)


  18. Here is a link to where the full proposed curriculum can be accessed:


    Since the HDC will only present two newcasters opinions on it, I thought I would find the actual thing.

    Then we will know the facts and not what Sean Hannity thinks.

  19. That was a great link Dandelion.

    It made me think of something that hadn’t even occurred to me until I saw the list of the couple dozen names that were involved with compiling this data. Who the hell paid for all this power-point and graphing work?

    It is really frustrating to listen to school people talking about how broke they are when they are spending 10’s of thousands doing reports like these. Who paid these people? Were they full-time? What about the other dozens of people involved? Did they get tax funded comp-time for volunteering their services to implementing this program?

    How can we find out how much has been spent on these sexual awareness studies throughout Montana?

  20. Freddy - Try this if you are really interested:

    Bruce Messinger

    Superintendent of Schools

    E-mail bmessinger@helena.k12.mt.us

    Phone: 324-2001

  21. At least no one has mentioned sheep yet

  22. Surely I still am not following your logic on this case with Fox News. Where does it say Fox News says the are under no obligation to be honest in their reporting? If you can find the attorney's argument before the appellate I would be interested in reviewing that. Barring that, I think you are missing the point. This appellate decision makes it very clear that the dispute over the content of the distortion Akre alleges was never resolved. A jury disregarded all of Akre's husbands claims and all but one of her's instead finding in favor of WTVT.

    I might also point out once again that this is simply a Fox News affiliate, yet you castiage all of Fox News for this one unproved allegation? And you talk about our (GOP) bias? Give me a break!

    This is nonsense and you know it.

    In any case Fox News is really not the point here, the point is Helena Public Schools needs to hear the outrage of the parents of that district and my heart goes out to the parents in Helena who want to retain their parental rights and reject this social engineering of our youngest kids with the immoral underpinnings of homosexuality. If a parent decides their child is old enought to learn about homosexualiy or other sexually explicit matters, it is up to that parent to decide, not the school.

    END OF STORY with me!

  23. I did Hillbilly although not in the context I think you are referring!! I was referring to the way we just keep sending our kids down the assemblyline in school as opposed to actually attempting to teach them.

  24. This is just proof the homosexual community is in control of the democrat party.
    It is just unbelievable that any one could possibly want to defend this type of activity.
    The “Baby Killers” have had the platform for quite a while so I guess it is time for the other half of the democrat party to have the platform for awhile.

  25. Railroader said: yet you castiage all of Fox News for this one unproved allegation? And you talk about our (GOP) bias? Give me a break!

    This is nonsense and you know it.

    C'mon, playing stupid doesn't become you. I didn't castigate anyone and it's in no way an unfounded accusation. I answered another poster's questione and noted a pretty well known case, AND provided you the actual ruling and the pertinent part and it's still nonsense? Alriiiiiiiiiiiiighty then. LOL

    Again, I didn't castigate Fox news. I pointed out a fact. Period.

    Lastly, please point out where I have ever pointed out any GOP bias. Please be specific as you've made a specific accusation.

  26. Thanks Surely for secondguessing my stupidity I guess that could be considered a half-compliment!

    On th castigation again you referred to Fox News collectively and you said they went to court to defend their right to lie. That is patently untrue, the focus of the lawsuit had nothing to do with Fox News or "lying" but rather a challenge by a former employee on the basis of a contract termination and whether or not Jane Akre could bring a case under the whistleblower statutes.

    As for my overgeneralization of your language as biased, I agree it was sensationalism, but I do seem to recall a suggestion by you that SusyQ might have been biased in the ACLU posts. Oh well, I apologize.

  27. Joe - thanks for being redundant and boring. I loved how well yiu generalized a political party into two separate groups. So does that make the conservatives adult killers and fundamentalist Christians?

  28. saw this comment......

    If they actually know how sex works, it won't be such a mystery and abstinence could possibly be argued for even more.

    i dont know, i think the earlier you teach kids how sex "works" the earlier they will figure out a way to try it.

    And how come if you discuss this topic at work, you could get fired, but its ok for a pre teen school kid to discuss it with his/her teacher. I really dont think kids that young need to know the the mechanical workings of sex.

  29. Railroader said:the focus of the lawsuit had nothing to do with Fox News or "lying"

    As I have already noted, that is not what the lawsuit was about but it indeed WAS the argument made in the appeal. Your ignoring the FACTS of the matter won't change them.

    I also apologize for the "playing stupid" comment. You just seem way smarter than your ignoring the facts of the FOX argument on appeal.

    Have a nice day.

  30. Axslinger- so should no one learn about sex ed, not even high school? Should they not teach anyone anything? I mean, yeah, making disgusting comments or sexual innuendos at coworkers can get you fired if its inappropriate, so does that mean we shouldn't teach any aspect of it, because no one should talk about it at work?

    I guess that get rids of most of Biology.

    Should we also get rid of all the TV shows that mention sex? I mean the same theory could apply, you can't talk about it at work, so why be able to watch it on TV?

    I mean, your doctor can talk to you about sex, but a teacher can't? It's not like random people will be teaching the students, its actual certified teachers teaching students.

    I know when I got physicals in middle school the Doctor asked me if I had any questions regarding sex, birth control, etc.

    And I do believe if you take some of the mystery out of sex, teens would be less likely to experiment with it. The consequences and responsibilities would be more evident and they might think more about the choices their making.

    I think if a teenage girl knew what pregnancy would actually do to her body, her mind, and her life, she would reconsider letting a boy get that far with her.

  31. axslinger and the like. Do you have any points of reference in the actual curriculum that you are opposed to or are you watching this BS clip from Sean Hannity tabloid show. To refer to this show or this blog as "news" is laughable. Here is the link to the curriculum

    And just for you axslinger here is another link to a site that will show you that early onset education doesn't lead kids into experimentation. Most of the modernized world teaches this stuff very early on and broadens it out throughout their curriculum. Take a look at their STD and Teenage pregnancy rates and moreover take a look at the price tag for those. 9.4 Billion dollar in the US in 2004...that is a chunk of change.

    Fear and Ignorance have taken over here in Helena. Trust me I was at the meeting the other night, where I had to stand outside with about 300 other people and while a young man who had recently graduated from Helena High was speaking about the struggles he faced as an openly gay student and how it made him feel to be called a "faggot" one lady in front of me yelled out "well you are".
    The curriculum calls for students to be taught that a human being can love someone of the opposite gender or someone of the same gender (which is a fact). Nowhere do you find in that sentence that it is OK or that it is bad. That would be up to the student and their parents to decide. You will find nothing in this curriculum that isn't fact based, if you do please point it out to me.
    Tobacco use, STD's, Teenage pregnancy, obesiety...all of these are TOTALLY preventable and all of these are addressed in the curriculum.

  32. for those that cant read, in my personal opinion, which i have a right to, especially since i have kids, is that kids PRE TEEN (12 and under flame) shouldnt have it shoved down their throat in a mandatory class. Thas all, just an opinion.

    Me and my like, as red so eloquently put it, dont have any refrence from any curiculum to base that opinion. Nope, just my gut feeling as a father. To be fair, i realize that im ignorant on the subject (the european studies, etc..) so im willing to stick around and read more comments and read your link red, and possibly learn more on it.

  33. Oh my, I was finally able to just watch the second clip the corrector provided. The only nice thing I can say is at least the host tried to play the devils advocate to Jeff. First off, she said that second graders would be taught that people can be "attracted" to other people of the same gender. LIE
    Then Jeff says that in 5th grade students will be taught sexual positions...WHAT...where? LIAR
    It really is IMPOSSIBLE to have an intelligent conversation with people who are not only LIARS but are using their lies to misinform our public. If an entire group of parents are outraged, I can now see why, they think their kids are going to be taught about "attraction" at 7 and what, the teacher is going to have diagrams about missionary and doggy style position. PAAALLLEEEZZEEE??? Do you see what we are dealing with?

  34. It is obvious your paycheck does NOT come from a private sector employer Red

  35. oh really freddy...how is that?

  36. Red: I hate to keep this going but for heaven's sake. You're right it doesn't say that second graders will learn this, it sayd FIRST graders will learn this!!!! Look it up page 45 of the curriculum.

    Oh and I supposed you're gonna say that "love" just means love and not attraction, right? Give me a break you mean we have to teach kids that they can love their dad or their brother or their sister or mother because they happen to be of the same gender? They are talking about relationships beyond acquaintenances.

    And on Jeff, I've heard a few other interviews he's given on the subject now and he says nearly the same thing in each one except I don't think you and he have the same definition of positions. I don't think he is referring to as you put it missionary or doggystyle, as opposed to descriptions of oral, anal and vaginal sex. He doesn't think 10 year olds need to hear in school about how anal sex works! I don't either.

    This proposal will go down in flames as it should and you know it! It is bad public policy, the majority of parents and folks aroudn the State and Nation are outraged and they should be this is a joke. This is an agenda by elitist liberal educators who feel they are better equipped to teach their ideological mindset to kids than their parents are. That kind of arrogance is amazing to me!

  37. well tax cheat, I see you can read. You can substitute any words you want and call them the same thing. The FACT of the matter is the word is LOVE which is something a 6 yr old knows and can relate to. Attraction on the other hand I am sure my 7 yr old daughter doesn't know about.
    The other FACT of the matter is that people can "love" a person of the same gender AND people of a different gender. If you want to read more into it that is fine. My 7yr old and 8 yr old go to school in Helena, and I was at the meeting the other night and there were about 60% against and 40% for in the crowd I was part of. The Independent Record did their own survey and that survey showed an overwhelming majority SUPPORTED this curriculum. Read the blogs on the IR and I would say it is about 50-50. This isn't a popularity contest either way. The FACTUAL statistics show there is a NEED for this education. Here are those statistics
    Here is another article with some more intersting statistics from a blogger;
    HLNMTALLMYLIFE said on: July 14, 2010, 6:25 pm
    People are correct Abstaining from sex is the only 100% guaranteed way of not getting pregnant, or getting an STD. What people don’t realize is that Abstaining isn’t what all people do. I applaud those that do. The reality of life is that most don’t. As of 2009 46.6% of all Montana High School Students (ages 14-18) have had sex. 54 out of every 1000 young women in Montana Schools ends up pregnant, and 16 of them either have abortions, or miscarriages. 1007 cases of Chlamydia were diagnosed in young adults ages 15-19 in Montana in 2009. 1228 in young adults ages 20-24. Chlamydia often produces no symptoms, it can cause infertility and chronic pain. The majority of Gonorrhea are also found in young adults, Gonorrhea is a bacterial disease that causes inflammation of the genital mucous membrane, burning pain when urinating, and a discharge. It is caused by a gonococcus bacterium. HPV - Human Papilloma Virus, Some types of HPV are associated with tumors of the genital tract including, and notably, CANCER OF THE CERVIX. HPV is 100% Incurable. Health Education isn’t just about sex, or orientation. But also Self-esteem, and how to treat other people. By allowing this curriculum to happen it will prevent Pregnancy and Abortions, It will teach tolerance, and HEALTHY life styles. And as I see it, allowing an “Abstinence Only” curriculum will work just as well as a “Communist Nation”. Both Great Ideas, but neither will work because people are people."

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  40. contd...
    So unless or until the majority of "parents" start doing their job, I guess we will have to see to it that someone does the job. Afterall we as taxpayers pay the price, to the tune of at least 9+ BILLION dollars per year in the US for these parents failure to do so. Plus if parents are doing as they say and teaching their kids at home, this curriculum does nothing more than reinforce what is being taught at home. If 46.6% of high school kids werent having sex than we wouldn't have to teach this stuff, but the fact of the matter is they ARE HAVING SEX. And we know they are having oral and yes even anal sex (which BTW isn't exclusive to homosexuals) and the misconceptions going around about both types is scary. They are having anal and oral sex because they think it isn't sex and they can't get pregnant that way. One of the public health nurses testified at the meeting that she sees girls everyday who come to her and tell her that they heard that if they drink Mt Dew after sex they can't get pregnant, that if the girl is on top she can't get pregnant. I had a student once that told me that if a girl does sit ups after sex she won't get pregnant. An elementry principal testified at the meeting that she recently had a group of 7 yr old girls who formed the "sexy butt club"...students in the 5th grade are wearing push up bras and low cut tops, and a 5th grade boy came to school with hickies. You say there is no need for this info, well the professionals disagree. Why bother having doctors, nurses, school principals, school nurses, health teachers if you aren't going to listen to their PROFESSIONAL OPINIONS? Plus lets not forget that if a parent so wishes to hide this info from their children, they can OPT OUT OF THE CLASS.
    You want to call me or them elitest liberal educators, fine with me. I could care less what names you want to throw around. I am concerned about the greater number of children who are engaging in sexual acts and have no idea what they are getting themselves into.

  41. You have quite a lot of conjecture here in your answer, but can you point to any evidence at all that this type of eduction reduces teen pregnancy or instances of STD's? No you cannot. This is a long on-going debate about the purpose of sex-ed. I am not saying we should not have sex ed, I am saying this type of eduction isn't necessary in K-6, and you will probably disagree with me and that is fine.

    Secondly what is to say that by subjecting kids this young to this type of education you don't actually promote experimentation which is even more dangerous especially among the younger kids.

    I agree society and some parents do not educate their kids properly, but this is just another example of the minority influencind the majority. Why should my kids and my parental rights be jeopardized because a few parents can't manage their parental responsibility. I don't agree with this curriculum as it relates to same gender relationships and the explicit nature of the human sexuality section for kids younger than 12. Period.

    So you say we can just opt out. That is a joke, you can opt out of the human sexuality section, but the other areas are riddled with references to alternative lifestyles too.

    As for the language issue between "love" and "attraction," your argument is absurd. They are not talking about platonic love, if it was then why is in the HUMAN SEXUALITY SECTION??? It is because they are referring to tolerance of alternative lifestyles and that again is none of the school districts business!!!

  42. You are a school teacher Red??????

    Are you in the grade school?

  43. tax cheat....I have already provided the link that shows how other countries deal with this subject and the results of that education. I have no other proof, because it has never been done in the US....we are the stupid ones who have spent billions of dollars on teaching our kids to "abstain" from sex. If you like I can present you with a thousand studies that show how much of a miserable failure that is. They are going to be taught that a person can love someone of the opposite gender or someone from the same gender and YOU as a parent can take it from there. So I see that you don't approve, that is fine and you can teach that to your kids too. But our school staff include homosexuals, our studnet bodies include homosexuals, we have students who have two mothers or two fathers and they deserve to be treated with respect. Nobody is asking you to approve, but is it too much to ask for tolerance. Have you been to a school lately sir, if you had you would know that the term "gay" can be heard fluently throughout the day. If someone is wearing a funny shirt...it is "gay", if someone is says something...it is "gay". And trust me they aren't suggesting anyone is Happy either.

  44. actually I am a school teacher currently not holding a full time position as a teacher. I have chosen to stay at home with my young children and am currently a substitute in Helena....is there a point here??

  45. It is really discouraging to have teacher siding with the homosexual community and the way they throw the word” tolerance around”. They want us to tolerate their deviate activity yet if there is prayer any near a school they go ballistic. No one died from praying but they die all the time from AIDS.

  46. Maybe if we would have kept prayer in schools,back when the kids had respect and morals,we wouldn't be having this discussion today.

  47. They want us to tolerate their deviate activity yet if there is prayer any near a school they go ballistic

    Oh brother....

    You really took the time to crawl out from under your rock to post that Joe? Can you say non-sequitor? LOL

  48. Joe...if you don't think that millions of people have died in the name of one God or another then you are sadly mistaken. God and the Bible are FAITH based, this curriculum is FACT based. You want to live in the land of fantasy that is fine, but don't ask the rest of the world too? They don't allow prayer in or around the school, because not everybody believes in the same God...don't you understand that. We have hundreds of religions and each one has their own God of some sort and own beliefs, we can hardly ask everyone to believe and worship the same.

  49. oops I meant to write, HAVEN'T DIED...

  50. It amazes me sometimes that people complain about tolerance and the education of our children and then they post something like this:

    It is really discouraging to have teacher siding with the homosexual community and the way they throw the word” tolerance around”. They want us to tolerate their deviate activity yet if there is prayer any near a school they go ballistic. No one died from praying but they die all the time from AIDS.

    I would rather have my children learn to tolerate everyone than have such narrow minded beliefs.

    Also, Ms. Lady Gaga was quite tolerant of some protesters at a recent concert: http://www.soundspike.com/news/tour/300-lady_gaga_tour_dates_and_tickets_lady_gaga_deals_with_anti_gay_protesters_at_st__louis_show.htm

    Further, to blame the homosexual community for the AIDS virus is just absolutely horrendous and uneducated. Pick up a history book, or a science book...

    And in conjunction with subsequent posts, do your research. Ever hear of a little hostile activity called The Crusades? Or the Spanish Inquisition? Or the Salem Witch Trials?

    Joe- I hope all of Montana adopts such curriculum as being proposed in Helena. I also hope that you have children in the public school systems so they learn about tolerance and acceptance instead of the hateful ideology I am sure they learn from you.

  51. Does anyone on here realize that sodomy is against the law in Montana.Not to mention what the bible says about it.How about beastiality should we teach them about that, people actually take part in that activity.They are both unatural acts and both illegal.You might as well teach them that all illegal activity is ok.I personally think they should teach 5th grade students on up about natural sex between a man and a woman.It was adam and eve not adam and steve.

  52. fed up....GROW UP would you please. Do you really want our police officers going around arresting consenting adults for private sexual behavior? What is your obsession with anal sex? Having intercourse of any kind with a consenting adult and having any kind of sexual relations with animals are quite different and if you cant see that, well then there is something WRONG WITH YOU. And could you paaaleeze get a new tag line, this adam and steve thing is boring....

  53. to red I am saying a man laying with a man is unnatural.They can,t reproduce.and as far as you are concerned i think you are a manhater.I don't hate homos,i will teach my kids that it is wrong,but i will teach them to tolerate everyone.men sleeping with men is as wrong to me as a man sleeping with a sheep.So you grow up RED and im glad you don't teach around here.I can't believe you're from the east end.

  54. well here is an idea for you fed up...if you don't like the idea of a man sleeping with another man...DON'T SLEEP WITH ANOTHER MAN. And while you are at it MIND YOUR OWN DAMN BUSINESS....how does it hurt you if other men like sleeping with other men? I can only imagine your poor children having to hear the filth that comes from your mouth and if they get any "tolerance" from what you spew I would be shocked. You best believe it...I am born and raised east Havre and proud of it. My momma raised me to be tolerant, accepting, to worry about myself and what I can contribute and to be a good person. I don't waste my time obsessing about what other grown adults do in the privacy of their own bedrooms. FYI, I have spent years in the Havre Public School system as a student teacher and a sub for many years....whoooo scary!! You really need to get a hobby if all you have to do is denounce homosexuality....you are a classic case HOMOPHOBE!!

  55. Homosexuality occurs in many animal species, including humans.

    Sadly, if Joe and Fed Up are any indication, so does blatant ignorance.

  56. You made it my business when it was brought up on this blog.So go home to your gay lover and kick her around for awhile and leave me alone.And take SURELY and her PARTNER with you.If homos are such private people how come they are the first ones to grab a banner and parade down the streets?Why don't they keep it in the privacy of their bedrooms instead of in my face or my childrens face.

  57. go home to my gay lover? Really, that is what you have resorted to? You are as immature as I thought you were. I don't care if you think I am gay...GAY IS OK. Trust me fed up...turn on your TV, open up a newspaper or a magazine. Heterosexuals are flaunting their lifestyle far more than homosexuals. When was the last gay pride parade in Havre?? LOL...see ya

  58. My thought is that you cannot use religious dogma to dictate the laws that govern man, or what man should learn.

    Religion and laws that dictate what is illegal and what is not illegal are separate ideologies.

    Further, if homosexuality is a crime, why are Christians not following all of the laws dictated in the Bible. I have yet to see anyone hold up the laws of Leviticus, or the rest of the Old Testament for that matter.

    Further, did not Christ come and say, "Love everyone as I have loved you." (John 15:12 and John 15:17)?

    I doubt Christ would post some of the hateful and rude things that are posted on this blog about people who are different that what a 2000+ year old religion dictates.

    Christ sat down and broke bread with sinners, got to know them, and tolerated them all.

    I have yet to ever meet someone who is homosexual and as completely intolerant as some who have posted on this blog.

  59. To Dandy i don't know why everyone thinks that i hate homos because i don't, i just think it's wrong.I admit that there is a lot of things in my heart like lust,adultery,and the list goes on. I do try to work on these sins but it is a struggle,and i'm not condemning no one,im just stating my opinion.I hope JESUS is tolerant than maybe I will have a chance.

  60. Fed Up: For the record, I am a heterosexual male with none of the hangups that uneducated, bigots such as yourself display almost every time you open your mouth on a subject such as this.

    Well done.

  61. For the record

    I like Bill Cinton's words on this subject

    Don't ask - Don't tell

    I don't care what you do at home and away from me but I don't think we have to have any parades glorifying the act itself. You can teach tolerance for people that are different without having to teach alternate sexual lifestyles to grade schoolers. Let the little darlings learn about gay lifestyles from the college professors that are knowledgable about it like Prof William Thackery

  62. To surely i am educated and i'm not a bigot the only differance between you and me is i have been taught morals.It's not a hangup of mine it's your hangup.Homosexuality is wrong,and the majority of the world share my views or else they could be legally married.Maybe you could tell me where Aids comes from.To the Hillbilly GOOD ONE...

  63. i'm not a bigot

    For you to say that shows that you don't even know what a bigot is. I'm shocked.

    the only differance between you and me is i have been taught morals.

    I see. So your morals are the be all end all of morals huh? That edumacation you spoke of is showing through. LOL

    Homosexuality is wrong,

    Says you? Ha! I note that you completely ignore the FACT that homosexuality occurs throughout nature. Damn pesky facts.

    ,and the majority of the world share my views

    A majority in this country used to be in favor of slavery too. Big deal. Time to get into the 21st century. We are all humans.

    Maybe you could tell me where Aids comes from.

    Better yet, perhaps you could educate yourself on the AIDS situation, both historically and in the context of the modern world and come back and try to spew your garbage.

    Thanks for the chuckle though.

  64. Surely: I can't believe you are comparing a homosexuals brain to an animals brain.But you are far more edumacated than I.Just try to be more tolerant.Thanks

  65. who takes faux news seriously besides the latest politico idiot from alaska?
    that particular institution makes a fool of anybody who acknowledges its existence.
    faux news has a single purpose...
    keep viewers divided on irrelevant "issues".
    they do their job well...
    look who gets caught up in their pablum.

  66. I can't believe you are comparing a homosexuals brain to an animals brain.

    I made no such comparison. I noted that homosexuality occurs throughout nature and humans are simply another member that partakes in it.

    Just try to be more tolerant.

    The irony of you making such a statement is hilarious. Physician heal thyself. LOL

  67. To Surely heres a pesky fact for you.A dog eats his own Feces,do you think people should do it?You my friend are an idiot.

  68. Wow, what a great comeback.

    Let's see, your reading comprehension is at such a low level that you can't even properly understand what I had previously posted and I'm the idiot?

    I would never denigrate true idiots by calling you one. They deserve far better than that.

    BTW, what a dog may or may not eat and the FACT that homosexuality occurs throughout nature are completely different issues. Nice attempt at diversion though.

  69. For everyone's information, AIDS is caused by the HIV virus which began in Africa and entered humans through the eating of the infected monkey's flesh.

    Not only gay people have AIDs. Straight people have AIDS. I think cats have a form of AIDS too.

    Many countries allow homosexuality and for homosexuals to marry. I believe Argentina either just passed laws or are allowing laws, as does Canada, Sweden, and other places through out Europe.

    There was another issue that people said was wrong, immoral, and inhumane....interracial marriage.

    Well, that idea changed.

    Homosexuality is not a new trend, it has been around for as long as man has. There is accounts of it through out history, including everything from Egyptians, Romans, Native Americans, etc.

    Some people do not agree with it, but that does not make it wrong. It just means that the person prefers people of the opposite gender.

    If, as a parent, your children come home and say that they are learning that two people of the same gender can love one another, all you simply have to say is, "Son/Daughter, as Christians we don't agree with that life style. However, we won't be mean or intolerant to those that choose that lifestyle, because God would ask us to love them and pray for them as He would anyone else."

    That's probably too far of a stretch though, especially for what I see passes for Christianity these days.